Altai Xangai

названия черных металлов: железо- төмөр сталь- болд или ган, ган болд, гянт болд чугун- ширэм откуда это слово БОЛД, БОЛОД, БУЛАТ?

The mural "Tea Ceremony" discovered in Xuanhua County in a tomb built in the Liao Dynasty Photograph of tomb wall painting featuring a Khitan horseman and his steed Mid-Liao dynasty, c. 11th c From Tomb #1 at Beisanjia Village Site Aohan Banner, Chifeng Municipal District Image courtesy of the Inner Mongolian Museum, Huhehaote (copyright reserved) Khitan Architecture The nomadic emperors of the Liao dynasty (A.D. 907-1125) built many pagodas, including Daming. Khitan Architecture At Suoborigasumu 索博日嘎苏木 in Balin Youqi, there still stand the ruins of Qingzhou 庆州 city from the Liao dynasty, with the white pagoda rising from its northwestern corner being the most prominent testimony of that era.

1. Wiyemi bijienni uzhele irewo. Виеми биеээн ни vжэлэ ирэво. /Виеми бижиенни vжэлэ ирэво. - Виеми- no idea. Is it name of person? or is it simply "БИ"-"БИЕ" mongolian "I" or "BODY" - биеээн- body - бижиен- ???? - vжэлэ -"vзvvлэx" -to be checked, to be shown - ирэво- "ирэв"- come Wiyemi bijienni uzhele irewo. - I/somone come (here) (my/his) body to (be) check (ed)/ see (show) --------------------------------------------------------------------- 1. дунсянский язык - бесписьменный. It means somebody listen to them and write what he heard. Me too. I need to listen how they speak, how they pronounce. 2. This Latin alphavit is is not clear. How shall I read for example:- y. j -bijienni - биеээн/бижиен?? j, zh - w, v s, c kieliezho- Mongolian "хэлжээ" - сказал - "said" It is very archaic or mixed , hard to understand. Sure, any ordinary Mongolian from Mongolia would not understand by reading this sentenceAt least you should let it heard how does the orginal sentence sounds like. I guess you should ask some other guys who is professional. As for me, any mongol related topic is my hobby-horse. not my profession

lots of familiar words in the sentence. But reading this does not make sense to try to translate it without hearing it. It is not good really suitable to try to translate Mongolic word in chinese/ russian or any other language pronounciation. For example:- in Beijing some streets has Mongolian name actually. Old Beijing hutongs still have mongolian name. But we don't recognise it and also Chinese don't understand meaning of the street name. Sikelang Hutong 屎壳郎胡同 - "Sikelang Hutong " means "Sweet Water Well/ Street" in Mongolian -Чихэрлэг худаг / гудам Mohe Hutong 墨河胡同 - "Mo He Hutong" means "a well that has a taste" in Mongolian- Муухай худаг/ гудам Mao Hutong 帽胡同 - "Mao Hutong" means "bad well / street" in Mongolian - Муу худаг / гудам

Jurchen Jin Dynasty 金 (1115-1234) The right picture is an excerpt from a Jurchen memorial, the right columns being the Jurchen text, the left columns a translation into Chinese. The Jurchen original reads: Alun wei jhinchenhu saha miyee jhejhimei / jhaulamai ahai amin mafa bifume jheche tutimei husun nugur aniya ujhu kankelemei [...] The Chinese translation reads: 阿倫衛正千戶撒哈連謹 / 奏奴婢父祖在邊出力每年頭叩[/朝貢...] The text can be translated into English as: I, Sahaliyan, Battalion Commander of the Alun Guard, respectfully / memorialize concerning the position which, after my father and my grandfather having made efforts at the frontier and, kowtowing, every year [offer tribute to the court...] The Jurchen script was invented by Wanyan Xiyin 完顏希尹 and Ye Lu 葉魯 on the orders of Emperor Jin Taizu 金太祖 in 1119. The script was based on the Khitan script and Chinese characters. This Larger Jurchen Script was enriched by a Smaller Jurchen Script that was in use from 1145 on. Unfortunately, not many documents written in these two types of script have come upon later generations, and we can only guess the difference between Larger and Smaller Script. But we know that many important Chinese writings were translated into Jurchen, like the Confucian and Daoist classics, the Tang period governmental records Zhenguan zhengyao 貞觀政要, or the history Shiji 史記. The Khitan script was abandoned by the Jin court in 1191. The Jurchen script contains about 720 characters, some logographic (pictures or symbols), some phonetic. Similar to Chinese, the Jurchen characters can be sorted by radicals and stroke number. Among the Jin period writers and thinkers we find many scholars that interpreted the Confucian classics, like Du Shisheng 杜時升, Ma Jiuchou 麻九畴, Wang Ruoxu 王若虛, and Zhang Bingwen 趙秉文, the last being the greatest representant of Neo-Confucianism among the Jin Dynasty philosophers. Jin period historiographers wrote down the history of their predecessor state, the Liao Dynasty. Both histories were not finished, but they served as basic material for the official History of Liao Liaoshi 遼史, compiled during the Yuan Dynasty. The official records of the Jurchen's own history are not preserved. Private history was written by many of the known scholars of Jin, but the only preserved book is Guiqianlu 歸潛錄 "Records after retirement" (also called Guiqianzhi 歸潛志) by Liu Qi 劉祁. The official dynastic history of the Jin Empire is the Jinshi 金史, finished in 1344 as a compilation under the guidance of Tuo Tuo 脫脫 (Mongol Toqtohan (Chinese: Tuo Tuo 脫脫), Toqtoha).

Khitan Liao Dynasty 遼 (907-1125) The picture to the right is the title of a Khitan-Chinese bilingue stele kept in the Research Institute of East Asian Culture of the Tokyo University (Tōkyō Daigaku Tōyō Bunka Kenkyūsho 東京大学東洋文化研究所), the right column is in Small Khitan Script, the left in Chinese, the text is: 道宗仁聖大孝文皇帝哀冊 "Mourning note of [Liao] Daozong ("Well-lead Ancestor"), the human and holy, deeply reverent and cultured emperor" Like many other peoples in East Asia, like the Koreans and the Japanese, the Khitan adopted the Chinese script as their writing system, and naturally wrote a large part of the literature in Chinese, especially political decretes, memorials within the Chinese-styles administration system, but also an important literature genre of the Confucian-educated elite, the poesy. The Khitan script was created around 920 AD under the guidance of Yelü Tulübu 耶律突呂不 and imitated the shape of Chinese characters. This first script is called the Large Khitan Script and borrows many Chinese characters without changing their original appearance, while also other characters are derived from a Chinese character and are changed slightly, and a third group of characters has no Chinese origin or counterpart but was invented independently. Like the Chinese script, the Large Khitan Script is logographic, that means every character expresses a word. But because the Khitan language is not related to the monosyllabic Chinese (one word - one syllable - one character) but belongs to the Altaic languages that are highly agglutinating (one word - many syllables) the Chinese logographic script does not provide an ideal writing system for Khitan. For the same reason the Koreans and Japanese invented their own writing systems (see Japanese Kana). Yelü Diela 耶律迭剌, brother of the first Khitan emperor Yelü Abaoji 耶律阿保機 (posthumous title: Liao Taizu 遼太祖) therefore created a new script based on the shape of Chinese characters and on the Uyghur alphabet (that was on its one side based on the Syrian alphabet). This Small Khitan Script was promulgated in 925 AD and was used parallel to the Large Khitan script, although we possess more documents in the Small Script. It is called "small" because the character units of this script are components of phonetic parts, instead of logograms. The Small Khitan script is consisting of syllabograms, but also of components that consist of a logographic part (a symbol) and a pure syllabic part (a sound). Both scripts were used until the end of the Khitan empire and were partially incorporated into the Jurchen script. The Khitan script was officially given up in 1191 by the Jurchen. Only very few relics of Khitan poems and literature are preserved, and much less texts or fragments in Khitan language. The use of the Khitan script (see below) was limited, and only few people mastered this script. we know that the official dynastic history of the Liao empire, the Liaoshi 遼史, compiled under the Mongol Toqtohan (Chinese: Tuo Tuo 脫脫), is based on several earlier "veritable records" (shilu 實錄) compiled during the Liao period. The only preserved private writing of the Liao time is Wang Ding's 王鼎 Fenjiaolu 焚椒錄 "Burning Peppers", an account of the case of witchcraft around Empress Xuanyi 宣懿皇后. Others like the "Collections of the Western Pavillion" (Xitingji 西亭集) by Yelü Zizhong 耶律資忠 are lost. In the sphere of religious literature a Buddhist canon was compiled, commented, and printed by woodblocks, Dazangjing 大藏經, later a second edition called Khitan Canon (Danzang 丹藏). The most important book compiled by a Buddhist monk of the Liao period is the Longkan shoujing 龍龕手鏡 (later shoujian 手鑒) "Hand mirror for the dragon niche", written by Xingjun 行均, a dictionary that reflects the popular characters, writing style, and pronunciation of more than 26,000 Chinese characters

нет, Я не имею никакого намерения поливать грязью СССР . вообще я не понимаю тот МОДА-"поливать грязью СССР". Но мы должны искать правду. я только писал что мы и вы были чужими. хотя мы читали и говорили что мы братья, вы были ОРОС АХ. Я всегда спрашивал, почему Монголы не заботились те российские/советские города. они говорят слишком дорогой или государственная собственность или также кое-что много причины. Одно ответ я думаю что это мы были чужими, хотя мы думали не-чужой Лично я - за реальной дружбы реальных людей между Россией и Монголией, a не пропоганда государства, . знаещь в Уланбаторе есть рестораны- китайский, японский, индийский, тайландский, мехсиканский и даже украйнский и т.д. Но нету никакой русский ресторан. что это говорить то.

спрашиваете почему? Потому что вы были чужими. Все, что вы (совки) сделали для себя было чуждо нам. нам говорили что вы как ОРОС АХ-"старшии брат", мы братские- Найрамдал - Дружба и т.д. На самом деле это не было так. Совки не жили среди свойх монгольских "братьев". Вы жили в "сегрегации". Даже в Улаанбаатаре, вы жили в сегрегации с высоким конкретным забором, . Почему русские жили в "сам сделанный сегрегацией"(в добровольной сегрегации) ? какова причина? были монголы или коровы опасны для вас? кстати это где? Багахангай?? не выглядит так плохо. Щас там ничего нету ничего не остался там в Багануур, Чойр, Мандалговь, Сайншанд, Мардай и еще много.

1. Имеет ли это какой-то смысл или выглядит как нескладуха? I am not sure. As I understood it is a song about guy who can not get hold of a girl and lost his charms Let me dare to translate it from my understanding. Алаг алаг морь чинь ээ-------Horse with piebald Аядуу сайхан гvйдэлтэй-----Has nice way of going ----- Авхай чамайг хvлээсээр-------Waiting for you lady Аргаа (чаргаан) барсан би---Wasted I, all my charms--- Өндөр өндөр морь чинь ээ ----This tall horse has Vнэн сайхан явдалтай----------Really nice way of going Хvvхэн чамайг хvлээсээр------Waiting for you girl Өнгөө зvсээн барсан би---------Wasted I, all my appearance (handsomeness) Алаг- алаг - галка, зебра, зебра, крапчатый, пегий, п (piebald) алаг морь- Крапчатая лошадь Above my translation is not 100% right, maybe wrong, it is only due to my error/ poor hearing Note: Also I don't know chinese.I hope other Mongolians can translate it into russian better .... 2. Связано ли это с китайским переводом? My chinese is basic. I don't know what is in chinese version. Seeing your russian translation, I don't think Chinese is direct translation of the song. 3. Значит ли это, что даурский понятен для халха-монгола? Well, as a halha-mongol, I understood it quite well (generally 90%). I have never met a daur person or never heard any daur language or similar dialects. In the first hearing I catch many familiar words, then listen again, then understand it. 70% is perfectly in Khalkha dialect, rest of it were similar to dialects of Buryats. It is only my individual opinion, I hope some other Mongolians would confirm it.

Thanks for the link. I have downloaded and listen some times. This is what I write down upon hearing Алар Алар мори шинээ Аядуу сайкан гvйдэлтэй Абкай чамийг хvлчээсээр Аргаа пааняа барсан би Өндөр өндөр морь шинээ Vнэн сайкан явдалтай Хvкvн чамииг хvлчээсээр Өнгөө зvсэн барсан би This is Mongolian (Khalkha Mongolian) transcryption accoRding to me. I hope Mr Enhd can come up with his opinion. Алаг алаг морь чинь ээ (I am not sure about word "Alar". I guess it is similar to Mongolian "Alag") Аядуу сайхан гvйдэлтэй Авхай чамайг хvлээсээр/хулжаасаар/хөлчөөсөөр/ хvсэсээр Аргаа (чаргаан) барсан би (I don't recognise the worD "пааняа". So I came up with my guess) Өндөр өндөр морь чинь ээ Vнэн сайхан явдалтай Хvvхэн чамайг хvлээсээр/хулжаасаар/хөлчөөсөөр/ хvсэсээр Өнгөө зvсээн барсан би ------------

Тарваганы боодог

good combination of music instruments,. http://youtube.com/watch?v=WoVW8GTTMCo Here http://youtube.com/watch?v=uym5BLa2or0 It goes very well all together, even with хоомей and harhiraa. At the end someone recite poem

На монгольском языке мы имеем "Үхэг", "Үхэгт тэрэг" 1. Монгольское слова "Үхэг" – буквально удлиненный шкаф, ящик, большой сундук 2. "Үхэгт тэрэг"- повозка Мэргус Ухэгэту-хаган ( Маркус Үхэгт хаан 1446 - 1456) - Второй сын Тайсун хана (Дайсун-хагана )

чьим? без сахара и Глутама́т на́трия, вкус китайской кухн сомнителен Глутама́т на́трия (лат. monosodium glutate, мононатриевая соль глутаминовой кислоты, код Е621)-— пищевая добавка, предназначенная для усиления вкусовых ощущений, за счёт увеличения чувствительности сосочков языка. Представляет собой белый кристаллический порошок, прекрасно растворимый в воде. У китайцев известен как «вкусовая приправа» у японцев как «чудесный порошок» («фе-цзин»). Вкус глутамата называется «умами», что является одним из основных вкусовых ощущений, известных человеку. Глутамат натрия получают как из натуральных ресурсов, так и посредством химических реакции

Ты не был в Монгол улс. А почему тебя раздражает этот постоянное битьё в грудь с выкриками "я жинхин халх" (настоящий монгол)?. По-моему это вообще не плохо. Дербеты, буряты тоже могут бить в грудь с выкриками "я жинхин дервед или бурят" (то есть тоже настоящий монгол) наборот, Монголы называют Бурятов, Калмыков- Ойраты и Ойроты,даже Тувынцов, некоторых Казахов как братья Монголы. Но много Калмыков, Тувынцы, Буряты отрицают это. Они говорят, что они - только Калмыкы, Буряты или Турки, только не Монголы EDIT:- очень рад за такого процесса Ну в результате. Монголы- только Халх Монголы остаются на родину с своями овцами в центре Монголии, нигде не пойти, но вставать и сказать, что я - Халх Монгол- Настоящий Монгол. Если вы встречаете Монгола, который бьет своего грудь с выкриками "я Халх Монгол", Уважайте его за его гордость. Если какой то казах кричит "я настоящий казах", Я буду уважать. Я уважаю таких людей еще раз, почему ты так думаешь если ты не был в Монголии не раз. чистокровный или полукровкный это не так важно, особенно среди Монголов. Но если тот человек (чистокровный или полукровкный ) - против нашей культуры и языка, то мы будем иметь реальную проблему с такими Когда то Ардын Хатанбаатар Сандагдоржийн Магсаржав сказал так “Монгол хvн гэж хэлvvлэхийн тулд Монголын тeлee цохилох зvрхтэй байх ёстой”

Very interesting.

Да он предъявляет претензии на консультации специалистов, сотрудничество с самими монголами. думаю он патологический лгун Film on Mongols Dismays Nation Written by B.Bulgamaa UB POST Thursday, November 22, 2007. STATE Honored Figure, People’s Artist and film producer G.Jigjidsuren has come down heavily on Sergei Bodrov’s film The Mongol as an unacceptable distortion of Mongolian history and as a brutal assault on Mongolian sensibilities. Its technical excellence cannot compensate for its consistent misrepresentation of facts and its possible commercial success does not speak for its artistic merit. The film, shown on TV channels in the country, has caused outrage. Echoing national sentiment, Jigjidsuren has said in an interview with the daily Mongoliin medee that he has information people in several other central Asian countries, earlier under Soviet domination, have “also reacted with aversion” to the film. “The memory of the Great Chinggis Khaan and historical truth both demand respect and honesty which the film made by a Russian does not show in any measure,” he said. Mongolian historians had asked Sergei Bodrov on a visit to Mongolia to involve local people in the production to ensure accuracy and integrity. He did not agree and as a result no Mongolian worked for the film in any capacity. They would have been paid handsomely but, as Jigjidsuren noted with approval, “for Mongolians more important was national loyalty”. “I cannot deny that we are at the moment unable to do anything likely to match the film’s cinematography, music, sound effects, editing and all those technical aspects of film making. We do not have the expertise and the equipment. But these technical qualities should not make anybody overlook the basic mistake, taking liberties with historical truth.” When the film is released worldwide, people there would get a very mistaken idea about Mongolia eight centuries ago. Jigjidsuren said Chinggis Khaan is “the national pride of Mongolians”, much as Peter the Great is for Russians. He recalled that in the 1970s, an American proposal to make a film about Peter was turned down by Russians because they found the screenplay showed the Czar as a drunkard and a debauch. “Despite the general technical brilliance, I found many things wrong with the film. I was not impressed with much of the acting abilities, and some roles were played without any spirit, with the actors unable to enter into the mind of the character.” he said. He wondered why nobody had bothered to study Mongolian tradition and practices with some care, for the sake of authenticity. “At least they wouldn’t have done the riding parts so wrong. This was an elementary mistake.” N.Nagaanbuu, researcher and writer, also found little “historically true” in the film which has “sullied the reputation of Mongolians as a proud people”. “I see Chinggis Khaan as one of the world’s geniuses. Why else does he attract people’s interest centuries after he died? Unfortunately the film has been made only for money. It is neither true history nor real art,” said Nagaanbuu. “I was pained to see that the general approach of the film was to present Chinggis Khaan as something like a wild animal. Wolves are often shown to be very near him, he kills Begter for a piece of meat, he makes an amulet with a bird bone, and venerates the skull of an animal.” Nagaanbuu found it strange that Chinggis, Borte and Zuchi talk to one another in Chinese in the film. “Was there any political motive behind showing Mongolia as part of China and Chinggis as part Chinese, part Kazakh?”

So acording to you ( maybe to some kazakhs) All modern Mongolian language speaking people are not people of Chinggis Khaan. Вы имеете виду , что все монгольские народы язык которых монгольский, не Монголы Чингис хан. on other side, Do kazakhs speak mongolian language of the time of Chinggis Khaan? Do you understand what is written in old documents of Mongol Khaans. What was the name of Kazakhs at the time of Chinggis Khaan? Yes you will say Naiman, Kereyit, Merkit and so on. Then why Chinggis haan did not name his empire "Казахьская империя, Найманская империя, Кереитская империя", but he called his empire "Mongol Empire"-Монгольская империя How can majority of Mongols of Chinggis Khaan can be "kazakh" when kazakh name did not exist at that time. You wrote "Казахами тогда ещё не назывались. Это более поздне принятый этноним" According to your logic Americans should write that "Majority of British islands are Americans or King of England, Henry VIII was American". понятно :kz1: тюркo-казахская династия Юань в Китай, казахские вторжения в Японию и еще Казахское нападение на Европу, чтобы разрушить казахских братьев-Кыпчакы. неправильно поступили ?? но бывают такие неправильные поступки за сепаратисткие настроения... как чеченцы? тогда все понятно, думаю хорошо что Казахы разрушили Отрара и убили всех казахских братьев за их сепаратисткие настроения, как царь Путин о его комманда разрушили Грозныи и Казахи были христианами тогда. Imagine there's no countries It isn't hard to do Nothing to kill or die for And no religion too Imagine all the people Living life in peace... Возможно Чингис Хан был феном Битлз, или Джон Леннон был Казахом А что такое карачаево-балкар, монгол или казах? Является ли эта пословица связанным с низкими населенными Монголами и многочисленным Тюрко-Казахами?

согласен с тобой, давайте не будем заниматься подменой понятий. But, if I agree with you and follow your idea, there are some question need to be clarified. Question just came out of simple logic. So as you wrote, Khalkha Mongols(халха-монголы) are not (это не есть) people (народ) of Chinggis Khaan (Чингисхана). думаю я правильно понял вас. But you know Khalkha Mongols are just small part of All Mongols. let me explain you quickly. All Mongols divided into Western and Eastern geographically (west and east side of Altai Mountain range) - Western Mongols are 4 Oirats - Hošuud (Хошууд), Choros (Цорос/Чорос), Torguut (Торгууд), and Dörbet (Дөрвөд). Hoshuuds moved to Tibet, Torguuts moved to Volga river. After that remining Oirats-( Choros-Цорос/Чорос, Dörbet-Дөрвөд ,Ölöt-Өөлд, Bayat, Hoit, telengit and so on) founded Zhuungar Khanate (Зүүнгар Хаант улус) . -Eastern Mongols are divided into 6 tumens/тvмэн and located in both side ( North and South side of Gobi desert. ---Northern Mongols are mainly Khalkha Mongols and Buryat Mongols. Khalkha Mongols are only 1 of 6 tumens, ---Southern Mongols are located in South of Gobi desert. Tsahar Mongols-Цахар,Khorchin Mongols-Хорчин, Tumed Mongols- Түмэд, Yunsheebuu Mongols- Юншээбүү, Ordos Mongols- Ордос, Найман, Харчин, Жарууд и т.д более 16 аймаг. My question is - Do you mean only Khalkha Mongols are not are not people of Chinggis Khaan or all other Mongols are also not people of Chinggis Khaan? - If Khalkha Mongols are not mongols, then who are Khalha Mongols according to your theory? - Who are the Oirats (western Mongols) ? - Who are the Southern Mongolians/ Inner Mongolians? If you are right on this- народ Чингисхана были тюрки - казахи и наверно первыми присоединились и киргизы, you might need to consider about names of your people. - You wrote that modern Mongols are not Mongols of Chinggis Khaan. Ok then Mongols of CHinggis Khaan must be you-тюрки и казахи. So you (тюрки - казахи) are REAL MONGOLS of Chinggis Khaan. Then Kazakhs are Kazakh-Mongols divided into Zhalair (kazakh)Mongol,Oshakty (kazakh) Mongol, Dulat (kazakh) Mongol, Uisun (kazakh) Mongol,Shaprashty (kazakh) Mongol, Kerei (kazakh) Mongol, Argyn (kazakh) Mongol, Uak (kazakh) Mongol, Konrad (kazakh) Mongol and so on. You like to be real mongols of Chinggis Khaan, then you should carry the name "MONGOL" with its pride and curse. Maybe you kazakh country should be called Mongolstan, not kazakhstan. Kyrgyzstan should be Mogolstan. So do you like to have name "MONGOL"? or do you just want to have only Chinggis Khaan and his glory? So let us, correct and rewrite everything related to Chinggis Khaan and his Mongols in history of XIII century. -не была никакой монголо-татарское нашествие на Русь, а казахо-татарское нашествие -не было никакой монголо-татарское иго, а казахо-татарское иго. -не была никакой монгольские вторжения в Японию, казахские вторжения в Японию. -не было никакой монгольская Династия Юань в Китае основана монгольским ханом Хубилаем, который завершил завоевание Китая в 1279, а была казахьская Династия Юань в Китае основана казахьским ханом Хубилаем. -не было нападение хана Батыя на Восточную Европу /на Будепешт/ Лигница/ Краков, а был нападение казах. хана Батыя на Европу. - В конце концов, сами казахи разрушили Отрара и убили всех казахских братьев - и казахи разрушили Багдад, - казах брат Беибарс боролся против казахской армии На конец то всё становится на свои места